How Grounded Leadership Helps You Lead with Strength and Confidence in Uncertain Times with Jason Hanson

Ashish Kothari: Hi, Jason. Welcome to The Happiness Squad Podcast. It’s so lovely to have you on the show, my friend.

Jason Hanson: Thank you, Ashish. It’s great to be with you. I really love your work, and it’s always a pleasure to talk with you again.

Ashish Kothari: Thanks, Jason. You and I are partnering on this amazing President’s Leadership Class you teach at CU. I know leadership development has been a huge passion of yours and something you’ve dedicated a lot of time to.

I’m particularly drawn to this idea you talk about—grounded leadership in times of change. Let’s dive into that. Could you start by sharing what you mean by grounded leadership and why you believe it’s essential, especially during this period of volatility and uncertainty?

Jason Hanson: Absolutely. Leadership development has been a significant part of my life, starting from when I was a kid growing up on the South Side of Chicago. It was a community with economic challenges and a lot of decline.

I was fortunate to have amazing people around me—individuals willing to serve and who believed that leadership starts right where you are. They gave me opportunities to try new things and keep moving forward in a positive direction until I could find my footing.

I also had a strong support system in my family and access to great opportunities, which worked in my favor. Still, I was heavily influenced by my peers and my environment. There was always a dissonance between what I wanted to do with my life and the examples I saw around me.

That’s what initially drew me to leadership development. I discovered that I responded well to it and had a knack for it. Over the years, I’ve sought opportunities to grow in this area and contribute meaningfully.

Today, I’m fortunate to focus on helping others grow as leaders. In my experience, many of us make choices based on what makes the most sense to us personally, but we don’t always take the time to understand others’ perspectives. Everyone is choosing what they believe is the best option for them.

When you step into a leadership role—especially early in your journey—it pushes you to explore new ways of thinking and interacting. It becomes your responsibility to adapt your approach to connect meaningfully with others and create opportunities for discovery.

For me, grounded leadership is about having a solid foundation of experiences to draw from. You can only go as high as the quality of your foundation. When you start to tap into those things that you are wired for—whether it’s your values, your passions, or the communities you care about—you’re already working so hard to put this effort in and contribute.

Leadership development, as I see it, is about helping people maximize the impact of the effort they’re already putting in.

There’s a growing need, and we live in volatile times. Existing systems often serve fewer people effectively, and we face growing disparities in the needs that are unmet, as we’re increasingly polarized, and as the sands are shifting. That’s why we need grounded leaders—people who deeply understand their beliefs, have tested them in real-world contexts, and bring a human element to their leadership.

Grounded leadership equips leaders to navigate change effectively. Leading often means venturing into uncharted territory, tackling challenges you’ve never faced before. It’s not easy, but with experience, you get better at it.

For me, grounded leadership involves:

A strong foundation in personal wellness and development.

Meaningful engagement with my community.

Having leadership insights from studying success, discovering my recipe for it, and putting it into action.

Those are some of the things that equip leaders to be effective when they’re leading today. And we don’t get too far away from the people's side of change.

Those big ideas, big causes, and success stories usually are not things that one person did on their own; they result from incremental improvements, compounding impact over time, and some of the things that we get to do because of who we worked with and what we were able to achieve together. That’s what I mean when I talk about being a grounded leader.

Ashish Kothari: I love those inputs, right? I’m taking away so many components, and I’m reflecting on my own experiences.

On one side, there’s this notion of having a foundation—having your own voice, your own values, your own perspective—rather than just trying to please others. I think that’s really important.

You talked about it: what ground are you standing on? What is your foundation? What are your values? What are your perspectives? At the same time, we must recognize that in a changing world, our perspective might be flawed, biased, or even blind to what other people need or where they are.

This ties into what you highlighted—the importance of connecting with others’ perspectives and understanding their needs. It’s about this duality: having a solid base while also exploring where others are and being open to changing our perspective.

Leadership, as you said, is about going into new frontiers and new territories. While we need certain skills to navigate those spaces, we might discover that what we have or think we know isn’t what’s needed in that moment. So, it’s also about being able to learn.

Another point I loved was when you highlighted that no one person achieves great things alone. It takes many people working together. That collective effort—bringing people together to solve challenges—is what makes leadership so powerful.

Thank you for sharing that.

Talk to me a little about truly grounded and authentic leadership. What role does it play in creating healthy, high-performing organizations?

Jason Hanson: In my mind, our most recent election demonstrates that there’s a large group of people who think differently than we do. We’re increasingly polarized, and that extends into many of the workplaces we find ourselves in.

Even if you set aside the paths people opt into or the choices they make, you’re going to work with people who see things differently than you. To be effective as a leader, you need to navigate that difference, lead change, and help people feel equipped to take action and move forward.

It’s about recognizing differences in readiness. Organizations need leaders who can set the stage for meaningful engagement, build trust and respect within their teams, and enable everyone to work more effectively together.

A lot of this boils down to the philosophy of the leaders. What’s crucial is implementing systems and practices that don’t rely solely on your presence as a leader—that work even when you’re not there.

At an organizational or enterprise level, we’re only as good as the vision we can articulate and the plans we can implement. To achieve that, we need to understand our audience and give them the tools to be effective.

I often think back to Maslow’s hierarchy of needs and his concept of “grumbles.” He talked about not just listening for the presence or absence of complaints but also paying attention to their content.

For example, are people saying, “I don’t have the tools to do my job,” or “I don’t feel seen and appreciated”? Wherever your team is in their process, it’s about having accurate self-awareness or situational awareness of their struggles and helping them take the next step.

We don’t need to wait until everything is perfect to get started. We get going to get better. Usually, we have enough to take that next step.

Organizations that tap into their people effectively and adjust their approach are the ones that thrive. The war for talent is real, and it’s a key factor separating high-performing organizations from others. Engagement plays a huge role in this.

I think about ideas like Net Promoter Scores—identifying the “movable middle” and figuring out where you can gain the most ground. Organizations rooted in philosophies like this are the ones I see performing the best.

And then there are the lag indicators, like retaining top talent. People want to do meaningful work. They want to go where they can do what they’re best at and where they feel alive.

Much of the work I’ve seen and contributed to is about helping organizations thrive through the engagement of their people and enabling them to perform at higher levels over time.

Ashish Kothari: So, Jason, before your current role at the university, you spent a lot of time in the corporate world, right? You were at Schwab and other places.

Talk to me about how you assessed and helped leaders elevate their game around these practices. So many people are focused solely on delivering performance—execution—and real leadership development often gets sidelined.

They might run programs, but are we really developing leaders, or are we just running some training? Share some practices from your corporate roles that ensured real leadership development happened, where people picked up skills and the results showed up.

At the time, the firm was adopting a new leadership model with four pillars, and our goal was to socialize it across the organization. We needed self-directed learning paths, knowledge capture for senior leaders approaching retirement, and training programs to help employees build skills and navigate increasingly complex changes.

We leaned heavily into concepts like situational leadership. As leaders, the onus was on us to adapt our message to meet the audience where they were. For example, with an enthusiastic beginner who might not know how to ask the right questions, it was critical to:

Set clear criteria in their plan.

Establish appropriate distances between checkpoints.

Take a more active role in shaping their development early on.

As their competencies grew, we could adjust our approach—whether by delegating with constraints, supporting them, or coaching them. These methods were incredibly helpful.

To implement these strategies, we often collaborated with external vendors. For example, we partnered with the Ken Blanchard team to introduce situational leadership concepts to different tiers of leaders, such as newly promoted vice presidents.

We also fostered a culture rooted in strengths-based development. When employees could show up and focus on what they did best—on their intuitive ways of thinking, feeling, and behaving—it elevated the quality of their day-to-day interactions.

These strengths naturally spilled over into how people engaged with each other and into the stories they shared outside of work. Anecdotal strengths conversations is not necessarily what Gallup called it all the time, but the ways that I would come to life and just have that intuitive way of knowing and being.

We did a lot with engagement, one-on-one coaching, and similar tools. At the time, the firm was struggling to attract and retain millennial talent. That appealed to me as a candidate because I had spent the prior decade specializing in that area.

During my time at Schwab, we improved retention for early-career employees—from just under two years to closer to three and a half years. Some of the work I did contributed to that success, particularly with self-directed learning paths tailored to different experience levels and career tracks.

It was exciting to be part of implementing a new leadership model and incorporating competency- and asset-based approaches. We helped employees specialize while keeping the client experience front and center.

One thing I loved about Schwab was how every meeting ended with someone asking, “How does this impact the client experience?” That focus was so ingrained in the culture. I have only great things to say about my time there and how focused we were on clarifying the business need and the impact for the other constituencies that mattered.

As a certified strengths coach, I worked with a team that initially focused on new vice presidents—those either new to the role or the firm. We helped them tap into their unique strengths and understand how they showed up as leaders.

It wasn’t about everyone achieving the same way but about normalizing the fact that we all get there differently. It's more about understanding how I achieve and communicating that so that everybody I work with has a sense of how I show up, where I'm inclined to start, maybe some of my gaps and the complimentary partners I might seek out to round that out.

Ashish Kothari: I love that. You’re highlighting so many important points.

It’s not a one-size-fits-all approach, and I appreciate how you mentioned using different modalities—from leadership programs that people run through, to coaching and helping individuals translate and build complementary skills, and then implement them effectively.

At McKinsey, we also embraced a strengths-based approach. About ten years ago, we made a significant pivot to make strengths-based development a core part of how we evaluated and developed our people.

We had this concept where no review conversation happened without discussing someone’s “sparkle.” What is Jason’s sparkle? What’s an area where he truly excels—where he outperforms his peers?

Of course, we had our competency model, which included problem-solving, communication, client impact, knowledge, and values. Everyone was expected to develop across all these areas, but we always emphasized identifying that one area of sparkle. Where does Jason stand out, and how can we help him double down on that?

It made a big difference. I’m a strong believer in this approach.

But look, most organizations aren’t strengths-based. They don’t have ongoing feedback sessions. Performance feedback is often limited to once a year and feels more like a checkbox exercise—deciding who gets promoted or what percentage increase someone receives in their salary or bonus.

I want to dig deeper into this with you, Jason. With your work at Schwab and now at the PLC, strengths seem to play a significant role.

For listeners who may be new to the concept of strengths, can you talk about why focusing on strengths is so important? From your experience and studies, why should individuals prioritize leveraging their strengths instead of just focusing on addressing weaknesses?

Jason Hanson: Sure. I can’t necessarily teach someone to feel motivated by a part of the process they’re not wired for.

One of the key benefits of strengths is that they align with how you naturally think, feel, and behave. These are your go-to areas—things that bring you to life.

We hear so much about imposter syndrome, where people feel unsure if they have the skills to meet the moment. Strengths can be one of the best offsets for that because they highlight areas where you naturally excel.

Gallup’s model refers to “glimpses of excellence” as clues to talent. These are moments when you excel in ways that don’t entirely make sense—where all the pieces come together effortlessly.

When you look at a person’s resume, those highlights often reflect their unique recipe for success. The right ingredients, actions, and circumstances aligned, and the results showed it.

Strengths are something you’re wired for. They’re cognitive systems and strategies that scale across your career.

For example, if you and I were doing a speed-reading exercise and you had an aptitude for it while I did not, you’d gain significantly more ground in the same time and effort. That’s the essence of strengths—it offers a higher return on investment and minimizes opportunity costs.

When you tap into your strengths, you’re more likely to know how to achieve success in the moment and find a path for continued growth and thriving in team dynamics.

Understanding how your team members show up—what part of the process energizes them—is key. It allows us to collaborate more effectively. We can say, “You’re excited about this part, and I’m energized by that part—how can we integrate these strengths into our plan?”

Most teams today are cross-functional, bringing diverse elements to the equation. Strengths help individuals sustain engagement over time and enable teams to work better together.

As a leader, I can compliment someone on their outfit or a job well done on a recent project. But if I can speak to who they are—their core strengths, those moments where they sparkle—that creates a deeper connection. This level of recognition translates into loyalty, dedication, and the kind of synergy that produces the best results.

At Schwab, we had a coaching framework for our monthly meetings. They were employee-led, and we focused on four key questions:

Where have I succeeded? What has gone well since our last meeting?

Where have I struggled? Where have I felt stretched thin, depleted, or missed the mark?

What help do I want from my manager? What support can help me focus on my work in the near term?

How will I incorporate my strengths more? How can I make ongoing, intentional investments in bringing my best self to work and developing my strengths?

You say it so well—flourishing is a competitive advantage. In my mind, strengths are a big part of that.

Ashish Kothari: Totally. You can’t flourish without focusing on strengths. I love those questions, and I also love how strengths allow us to get the best out of people.

Your notion of the need to be seen is so universal—it’s present in all of us. When we recognize someone’s strengths and reflect that back to them, we’re seeing them.

I love that. I also think strengths tie into where we can create more meaning in our jobs. It reminds me of the work of Jane Dutton and Amy on job crafting. The more we use our strengths, the more meaning we can create in our work.

Beyond that, when we’re able to align people’s strengths with the roles they perform, we see significant benefits. If someone is using their strengths, they’ll perform tasks faster, more efficiently, and more effectively.

This naturally leads to a performance advantage—you’re recognizing the person, engaging their heart, and inspiring them to contribute more. You’re also creating more meaning for them in their work.

I love those questions: Where have I succeeded? Where have I struggled? How can my manager help me? And how can I use more of my strengths? You mentioned integrating these questions into monthly dialogues at Schwab.

Jason Hanson: Yes. Every month, my formal meeting with my manager followed that structure. I created the agenda, and we unpacked it together.

It positioned me to bring solutions as part of the conversation, while also giving me the space to ask for the help I needed. It normalized the idea that parts of the process can be messy—and that’s often where the best outcomes come from.

By addressing challenges early with questions like these, we could course correct and improve along the way.

Ashish Kothari: That reminds me of a process called PMI—Personal Management Interview—at Michigan, developed by Kim Cameron.

It’s deliberate, it’s conversational, and it’s ongoing. It’s not just one-way feedback; it’s a continuous contract through which we collectively rise, support each other, flourish, and become the best versions of ourselves. I love that approach.

Jason Hanson: I need to learn more about that. That sounds great—I love it too.

Ashish Kothari: It really is powerful.

Tell me a story, Jason—maybe from your time at Schwab or even in your PLC classes. Can you share an example of what became possible when someone either didn’t know their strength and discovered it, or had the opportunity to fully use their strength? What impact did that have on them and the organization?

Jason Hanson: When I was at Schwab, one of my early coaching meetings after completing my certification stood out to me. I’d been coaching for some time, but that additional training allowed me to go deeper.

I was meeting with a vice president who was new to the firm and in a strategy role. As we unpacked their strengths results, we noticed that strategic thinking wasn’t one of the domains where their strengths showed up.

Their immediate concern was, “Do I need to tell my boss? Should I be looking for a new role? I’m in a strategy capacity, and none of my top strengths are in strategic thinking.”

In strengths-based development, that top section represents the traits that are inherently “always you”—the things you have to actively turn off. So we quickly shifted the conversation to their performance. They were clearly achieving their goals, succeeding in their role, and performing well.

We discussed how these weren’t necessarily the parts of the process that energized them, but they were incredibly effective at helping their team succeed. They excelled at building teams of complementary partners—teams that understood how to collaborate, overcome obstacles, and perform at a high level.

This leader became very intentional about ensuring strategic thinking themes were present and highly prevalent across their key team members. They worked to offset their own gaps by building the right team and by recognizing the conditions under which they performed their best.

For example, they identified that detail-heavy work was best done in the morning when they were fresh. In a role where you can’t always control your schedule, they planned intentionally, building offsets to manage tasks that drained them while ensuring they had energy for other priorities.

This person went on to have significant success, in large part because they were so intentional about leveraging their strengths and understanding how to sustain their performance over time.

Schwab’s strengths-based culture also supported this. Nearly all 22,000 employees had taken the strengths assessment, and it was a normal part of how people interacted. This VP understood that strengths would be a key part of conversations and expectations, which gave them the insights they needed to thrive in their role.

In one session, we explored whether their current path was the best fit. They were new to the firm, so we worked on testing hypotheses, pressure-testing ideas, and identifying whether their role would continue to align with their goals.

Last I heard, they were still in their role, thriving, and very happy with their work. It’s a great example of how strengths help people succeed in different ways. By understanding how you perform and which parts of the process energize you, you can make more informed decisions and create a positive ripple effect.

Ashish Kothari: Yeah, I love it. There are three things you clarified in that story, Jason, that really stuck with me.

First, strengths aren’t necessarily about roles or whether you’re a fit for one. Strengths are more about recognizing what you need—or might be missing—to be successful in a role.

Take the example of being in a strategic planning role, but not having strategic thinking as a strength. That’s okay. It doesn’t mean you need to quit or hide it.

What it means is, to be successful, you have to ensure there are others who can fill that gap for you. Strategic planning isn’t solely about strategic thinking—it’s also about bringing people together, aligning around what the team is going to do, and making sure the strategic plan translates into an actionable operational plan with clear metrics and measurable progress.

Maybe there’s a part of the process you’re really good at, and that’s where your strength lies. But we often paint everything with the same brush. It’s not that simple.

I love this point: it’s not about the role—it’s about knowing what you’ll need to complement your skills.

The second point is understanding which parts of the process will be draining versus the ones that will come easily to you. Knowing your own rhythms—when you’re at your best—is crucial. It’s about doing the most demanding work when your energy and focus are highest, ensuring your cup is full when tackling those tasks.

I love that. And, as you said, they got to where they are now, and they’re thriving in that role.

Another powerful point you made is that many people have had a conversation about their strengths at some point. If you’re a senior leader or even in mid-to-upper management, you’ve probably had a coach who introduced you to a strengths assessment. Maybe you took Gallup’s StrengthsFinder, received some insights, and walked away with valuable takeaways—but then you put it aside.

Now imagine if the whole organization—not just individuals—embraced strengths-based development. Even if you can’t influence the entire organization, start with your team.

If you have the budget, use Gallup StrengthsFinder—it’s fantastic. If you don’t, check out the free VIA character strengths assessment from the University of Pennsylvania. It offers a different, values-based perspective on strengths.

Have your team complete a strengths assessment, and then share results over lunch. Talk about your strengths and explore how you can leverage them together. It’s a conversation most teams never have, but it’s such a powerful tool. If harnessed effectively, it allows us to achieve so much more—both individually and collectively.

Jason, I was struck by the fact that at Schwab, the entire organization was committed to knowing their strength scores. Did you explicitly encourage new teams to share their strengths and align roles accordingly? Was that part of Schwab’s culture?

Jason Hanson: It was. There were volunteer strengths champions who could facilitate one-on-one conversations or get a manager engaged with the process. We also had built-in strengths coaches who helped bring everything together.

There were ongoing lunch-and-learns and Zoom-based interactions focused on strengths, normalizing the practice, and making it an integral part of the culture. Every new employee took the strengths assessment as part of their onboarding process—it was embedded in the company’s story.

They prioritized the client experience and employee engagement. This focus reduced regrettable turnover, improved net promoter scores, and increased employee retention. Average employee tenure shifted to 11 years—there was a noticeable divide where people either stayed under two years or over 11, for various reasons.

Strengths played a crucial role in this transformation. It helped employees get in motion and stay on a great trajectory.

Strengths also became a key part of team formation. People got past some of the initial hurdles in a strengths-based model, like “barrier labels.” For instance, someone might assume, “I only want people with strategic strengths on my strategy team.” But quickly, they realized you don’t necessarily need strategic strengths to be effective in strategic work. What’s essential is self-awareness and self-regulation to proceed effectively.

Ashish Kothari: And have balanced teams, in fact—teams with a mix of all different strengths—are often better positioned for success.

Jason Hanson: Right.

Ashish Kothari: I love that. People often try all sorts of initiatives, but there’s power in choosing one or two, fully committing to them, and seeing the results.

We’ll include in our show notes the Schwab case study you mentioned from Harvard, which highlights how net promoter scores, customer experience, and employee experience were interlinked and delivered significant impact and results for the company.

I’ve worked with several people from Schwab over the years, and I agree—it’s a fantastic organization.

Now, I have a question for you.

You’ve done so much strengths-based work, Jason. What are your five signature strengths, and how have they helped you navigate your transitions—from academic to corporate, back to academic, and working with all these different students?

What are your strengths, and how have they supported you in these transitions, my friend?

Jason Hanson: Thank you. It’s always a joy to talk about my strengths.

My top five are Strategic, Activator, Ideation, Individualization, and Connectedness.

I’m someone inclined to lead with strategic thinking. If you’ve ever seen the Jason Bourne movies where he opens up a map, analyzes all the variables, and instantly knows how to pivot when circumstances change—that’s how strategic thinking works for me. It’s about seeing alternate paths and having a scalable plan. You’ve probably heard this come through in the things I get excited to talk about.

The Activator in me shines in my coaching work. I have an above-average ability to help people get in motion when we know enough to get started. I help them see that we have the information we need to take the next step, which creates momentum quickly.

With Individualization, I’m naturally inclined to tailor messages to the people in the room. If we’re already putting effort into reaching people with an idea, let’s make sure the message aligns with where they are in the process.

Connectedness gives me an ability to see how things are interconnected. I can quickly identify the paths that operationalize ideas and bring them to life.

Finally, Ideation means I’m full of ideas. I thrive in brainstorming sessions, where some of my best work comes from starting a process with others, processing out loud, capturing ideas, and finding that agreed-upon next step to move forward.

As a leader, I’ve applied these strengths in various ways. For example, with Strategic, I often get to a point of understanding new information and adjusting to changing contexts faster than the group I’m leading. I’ve learned to pace myself and align my process with the group’s readiness for change. Tools like the ADKAR model have been incredibly helpful for layering strategies that meet everyone where they are.

Ideation also comes into play when I can collaborate early on to brainstorm and capture ideas. Once we identify the next step, I focus on getting things in motion.

We integrated strengths into leadership programs, helping people uncover their authentic voices and feel affirmed. It gave them an early realization that when you align with your strengths, the right things fall into place.

This firsthand experience amplified their work, made their journeys more meaningful, and made them more competitive as candidates. Early-career self-awareness is often lacking, but we helped students understand they were in a process and at a stage of development. This approach created standout candidates—not just because of their inherent talents, but also because strengths acted as a finishing school that prepared them for success.

Ashish Kothari: That’s so true. When you’re early in your career, you often don’t even know what your strengths are—you’re just fumbling your way through.

Since you’ve shared yours, I’ll tell you mine. Actually, maybe I should ask you: given how much strengths-based work you do, what do you think my top five strengths might be?

Jason Hanson: I’d say executing is definitely a big strength for you. You just show up in such a complete way, in my experience with you, that it’s hard to parse out. I’d imagine you’re energized by the achiever theme—getting things done, crossing items off your list.

You have that workhorse capacity to drive things forward. Let me think more about what I’ve seen.

Ashish Kothari: That resonates. I pulled up my strengths just now—this conversation reminded me to look at them.

One of them is Connectedness—being able to see how all the pieces fit together. For example, Jason, this strength helped me recognize that while there’s incredible work being done around energy, purpose, and relationships in leadership, it wasn’t enough.

I realized we could teach leaders about these areas, but unless we fundamentally helped them shift their root perspective, develop vertically, and learn to thrive in complexity, they wouldn’t be at a level to effectively apply those skills. That’s why we integrated awareness into our model.

Another area where Connectedness played a role was recognizing that if leaders were exhausted or working in ways that weren’t neuro-friendly, they couldn’t implement the other concepts. I brought in elements from Oxford and other sources to address this, helping leaders reimagine their environment so they could fully utilize their skills.

Another strength is Positivity—no surprise there! I’m always filled with energy. Then there’s Empathy—feeling into where someone is and being able to energize and excite groups quickly.

On the execution side, it’s Maximizer—pushing for the best and striving to maximize potential.

Those are my top five strengths: Connectedness, Positivity, Empathy, Maximizer, and Achiever. They’ve been a big part of my journey and have helped me tremendously.

But I also recognize the shadow side of these strengths. For example, my Maximizer stems from early childhood, where I felt that nothing short of perfection mattered. I’m mindful of overplaying that strength and ensure I get input from others to balance it out.

As we all know, any strength overused can become a liability. You can excel at Woo, but if you’re wooing people into things that aren’t good for them—or if you’re not authentic—it’ll backfire quickly. It’s about recognizing and managing these tendencies.

I love strengths-based work and wish more organizations and teams kept it front and center.

One big takeaway for me from this conversation is the importance of having an ongoing monthly dialogue with your managers.

First, acknowledge and recognize your strengths—do that with your team. Second, I love the four questions you mentioned:

Where have you succeeded?

Where have you struggled?

How can I help you?

How can you use more of your strengths at work?

This ongoing dialogue is such a practical and actionable way to help every team member grow, develop, and operate at their best. I’m taking these questions away with me. They’re beautiful and so impactful.

Thank you, Jason.

So, my friend, in closing, if there are one or two pieces of advice you’d offer young leaders, what would they be?

We’re no longer in a world where people stay in one job forever. Today, most people have four, five, or six different careers.

As someone who’s mastered career transitions, what are two or three things you’d recommend to help others maximize their results and succeed through transitions?

Jason Hanson: Thank you for letting me share.

I think one of the key challenges we face is wrapping our heads around the definition of success. Early on, we often try to do what we think we’re supposed to do—what sounds impressive, what makes our parents happy. We focus on being effective, earning the paycheck, getting the promotion, or having options.

What I’ve learned through trial and error is that I’m drawn to work where I get to collaborate with people who are enthusiastic and eager to learn. There’s something energizing about working with those who are unencumbered by experience and fully committed to making the most of their opportunities.

For me, I’ve found this sweet spot in working with students, contributing to high-performing organizations, and coaching. Having the opportunity to serve and contribute in this way has been deeply fulfilling. But it took a lot of experimentation to figure that out.

So my first piece of advice is to tap into your personal definition of success. Think about the people in your life who know you well and have your best interests at heart. Incorporate their perspective, but also trust your inner knowing. That self-awareness is key to achieving fulfillment, success, and happiness.

Secondly, I’d say this: Don’t wait for perfection to get started. It’s never perfect. There’s no job where every task aligns perfectly with your strengths. We need to deliver because organizations exist to add value by solving problems.

Tools like StrengthsFinder are fantastic for identifying your strengths, but you need to try different things to discover what works for you. This process will provide the data points that inform your next steps.

It’s important to recognize that it only gets harder the longer you wait. This is as easy as it’s going to be, and you already know enough to get started. So take action and get in motion.

Lastly, I’d emphasize the power of connection and meaningful relationships. Without those, the experience can feel hollow, shallow, and fragile. Relationships are what anchor us and help us weather the storms.

Ashish Kothari: I love all three of those insights. Thank you, Jason.

I deeply appreciate you joining us today and sharing your experiences—not just research, but real, lived, battleground experiences. Thank you, my friend.

Jason Hanson: Thank you so much. I’ve really enjoyed our conversation today, and I love the work you do. Thank you for sharing it with us.

Ashish Kothari: I’m excited for all the opportunities we’ll have to do great things together.

Jason Hanson: Same here. Bye.